Jul 15, 2016

Police are shady in every country. Personality wise they've got more in common with criminals than the average person.

 

Jul 15, 2016

But based on...what? Police killings (at least recorded police killings) have been on a steady, moderate upswing the last 12-13 years, all while on-the-job police deaths are plummeting. You have militarized police barreling through neighborhoods to break up peaceful protests and, undoubtedly, to provoke riots. Every bit of evidence we have suggests things are escalating--what leads you to believe they're cooling off?

 

Jul 15, 2016

you say that but ur cavalier tone comes off as incredibly dismissive and, yes, racist.

i'm not saying you're unintelligent -- nor should you hold any weight about what i think based off your posts lol -- but alot of your stances (off the cuff tho they may be) imply ppl who disagree with you are foolish or short-sighted. kind of cartoonishly unfeeling conservative. wpg is excitable but i think he's generally right this is a major problem/has created a firestorm of unrest. there need to be solutions... and btw, conservatives are torpedoing the bipartisan criminal justice bill currently in congress

 

Jul 15, 2016

Man, you might have to take a step back and consider that you're completely and obviously butchering your analysis here. The various researchers cited are not working from incomplete and biased data; they're condemning law enforcement for keeping incomplete and biased data, and then independently researching and verifying new data sets that more accurately reflect what's happened.

These are all peer-reviewed. You're not breaking the bank by knowing what confirmation bias is. They've all been scrutinized.

The numbers are inarguable. The way the police police is colored by race. If you want to continue to do mental gymnastics to come off like a contrarian, be my guest. But you're doing a poor job of it so far.

 

Jul 15, 2016

Genghis khunt thinks he knows everything

 

Jul 15, 2016

yeah, reread everything in depth to make sure, and the article did not once provide any evidence of this, only made the assertion. But anyways
Next study. Here's the article's summary


What the f---? Crime variables did not matter? So on an individual level, you think that having a criminal history has less to do with the possibility of the person being armed than skin color? Well s---, lets take a look.


correct, carry on.

Indeed, that is roughly 2.5 times more likely. But the problem here is that simply adjusting for population has the similar problem of ignoring the other characteristics and non-racial demographics of police brutality victims.

We already know that police brutality is more evident in places with higher poverty rates (crime rates aswell, but this is only because crime rates also coincide with poverty rates and there is another factor of socioeconomic vulnerability of the victims in question). So simply looking at population neglects the fact that both races have different socioeconomic compositions . Meaning that black people are simply more likely to fall within GENERAL police brutality demographics than white people. The evidence is right here



So when 26.2 percent of blacks are poor, and 10.1% of whites are poor, we can conclude that black people are.....
*drum roll please*
approximately 2.5 times as likely to be poor as white people.
The correlation is near perfect, and seems to be the exact same thing with Hispanic people.

The rest of the article goes on about crime rate and conspiracy, corruption etc. But the correlation is right here.

 

Jul 15, 2016

I don't which is why i actually took the time to read the studies. And is also why i constantly remind people that my knowledge of this issue will be by default more limited because i am not american. I don't hear about american shootings in the news (as often as you do anyways), i hear about my own people getting killed.

 

Jul 15, 2016

No they admitted to both the data and the methodology being incomplete in the very same study, of which i provided a clipping of them saying so in the post i made. they left out variables and the data is incomplete, apart from that the incomplete data collection is not sequential by date, meaning the results won't be progressive by nature, which should create a very massive error in the calculations.

I know, which is why instead of trying to prove that i know what it means i simply pointed out it's existence. I fail to see why you had to frame this (something you do alot) .

But they , the guys who made the study, THEY f---ing said it wasn't inarguable and it was incomplete. Also, assuming it was and was completely factual, the number they gave in the study would still be very debatable since it was a qualitative analysis done with an incomplete list of variables. THEY also said this.

Are you trying to disprove me by contradicting what the study itself says?

I disproved that with the second response. Instead of limited and incomplete qualitative analysis which could fly in any direction after adjustments, i found near perfect correlation by simple calculations of poverty rate and brutality rates. If i used the crime/murder rates, then what we will see is not correlation, but rather we will that white people are killed more by police than blacks in comparison to how much each groups commit murder and by a substantial amount at that. Why not look at culture, have there been any studies that show how both races react in police confrontation. Is the way BLACK or even f---ing ASIAN policemen police colored by race or is this an individual thing where some police happen to be racists. Or not so, but just an individual who appreciates the fact that African Americans are simply more dangerous statistically in majority black areas.

I will very much agree that police brutality is an issue, but i think it's very disingenuous , ineffective and incorrect to frame it as a racial issue.

 

Jul 15, 2016

It only comes off as cavalier because I'm not interested in converting anyone. I appreciate opposing views and I don't want to silence them, I want to probe them. It's funny how easily people get called racist.

Anyways, isn't making people feel like they're foolish and short sided the standard reaction to an opposing opinion on a message board?

 

Jul 15, 2016

True, but it's typically the racists who feel the labels being overly applied, no? Funny how that works. I agree about probing, it's all about discussion, after all. that's why I asked about your student loans. My suspicion is you're somewhat entitled, which affords you the ability to dismiss cries of racism as kneejerk. (Our backgrounds inform our vantage points, right)

Not in 2016. We respect and care about each other.

 

Jul 15, 2016

No, it is very much being overused. Saying that all lives matter, supporting trump, and disagreeing with WPG about police brutality does not make you racist. Nor does making comments about black people committing more crimes or criticizing a movement make you racist.

I'm pretty sure WPG has used the word racist in all of these scenarios before.

 

Jul 15, 2016

I honestly cant tell if this is sarcasm or not. You should spend more time here.

 

Jul 15, 2016

I acknowledged its overuse. I also recognize it's usually racists who whine about it being applied to them. Nuance.

 

Jul 15, 2016

I want to say that your claim that typically racists are the ones complaining, is probably itself a part of the problem (you are referring to quite a few people as racists), but i have no evidence that the folks you encounter are actually racists or not. So meh. I'll leave it there.

 

Jul 15, 2016

Except that police deaths in 2016 are higher than previous years and will likely be much higher by the end of the year.

I know you don't want to believe it, but police are keeping people safe by breaking them up before they escalate. People running around on the freeway is not safe, regardless of their cause.

You don't even need to respond because I know we will never agree on this. I fundamentally disagree that police are systematic racists.

 

Jul 15, 2016

Very intellectually dishonest response. You're hiding behind being "above" debate because you can't justify your POV.

 

Jul 15, 2016

Lol at the uppity privileged white folk in here. So worried about black people from the confines of their safe suburban white neighborhoods.

 

Jul 15, 2016

More so that I know WPG, who thinks we shouldn't even have police, isn't worth arguing with over this.

 

Jul 15, 2016

The fact that you are shameless enough to continue to post on here only confirms that your real life is actually MORE embarrassing.

 

Jul 15, 2016

Police officer deaths since 2009 (when Obama took office, coincidentally) are generally the lowest they've been since the early 60s.

I don't know how you could watch footage of protests being raided by cops in riot gear and claim that it's the police actually de-escalating things. If you don't care, that's fine, but there's no way you could actually make an argument to that effect.

I agree that we'll never come to an agreement on this. That the police treat different races differently is not some abstract concept to agree or disagree with--it's demonstrable.