May 15, 2016

of course it's subjective wtf, this isn't arguable

 

May 15, 2016

It's completely subjective

That's why it's so fun to talk about

 

May 15, 2016

Obviously art, or even something more concrete like public policy, is never going to approach the levels of objectivity you find in math or physics. I think some people reject music (or film, or literary) criticism because they incorrectly believe that critics are trying--and invariably failing--to reach those levels.*

But that's not what criticism--or for our purposes, forum discussion--is about. Critics are supposed to make arguments about a work based on what's present within the work, or depending on your school of thought, theory, history, and social context. A well-argued review of It Was Written (or A Tale of Two Cities) isn't supposed to be an absolute, scientific truth; the height of criticism is a reading of a work that becomes indisputable.

*Of course, some schools of critics have contributed to this phenomenon. New Criticism, which took hold for much of the 20th century in lit and film, was predicated on the idea that there WAS an absolute truth about the work, which often leads to stodgy, needlessly academic writing. The inverse is taking hold now, where some outlets are publishing "reviews" that amount to barely more than personal essays. Both approaches cause readers to roll their eyes, understandably. But good criticism (or, again, a good forum discussion) is about making compelling arguments about works, not arriving at a magical, knowing answer.

 

May 15, 2016

Don't turn my thread where I'm trying to understand music in some old vs new bs plz

 

May 16, 2016

because

in their opinion

they think its better

and instead of prefacing EVERY post ever with "in my opinion" we just do this thing were we post our opinions

then...if people dont agree...we talk about why we think what we think and try to explain


for example:

you think cant tell is a top tier young thug song. you say it has a great beat, amazing features, and thug kills the hook and his verse

i say its not even top 50. because 1) thug has 100s of songs that are as good as each other so it's a crowded list to begin with 2) can't tell is too long, the features are kinda lackluster and it lacks replay value for me

we can go back and forth about who has better reasoning and maybe you'll agree that i was right and the features aren't THAT great and maybe at the same time you'll convince me that "replay value" isn't a fair way to judge the track

in the end, if it's a good convo one or both of us will have a better grasp on the track. it doesn't mean that you need to stop thinking its a top tier track or i need to have it in my top 50 immediately...but maybe one of those things will happen down the line

i can say Kendrick is a better rapper than Eminem all i want, and as long as I can make a good argument for it -- people will agree and treat it like fact. Once that argument gets too weak, people will question it more and it won't be fact...

not really sure how many other ways to put this

art is subjective but there can be reasoned consensus

 

May 15, 2016

you are literally the worst poster on this site. like, you don't even have an avatar, why the f--- are you here? to quote someone praising an artist just so you can say oh "its trash, but this complete dog s--- album is better" its literally every post you've ever made, but they all lack creativity so they're just piss-poor boring posts. like log out forever your that s--- bro.

 

May 15, 2016

d--- this is deep

 

May 16, 2016

Hopin to get some unironic likes from that young thug comment

 

May 16, 2016

You got this thread from me and @Cyreides convo.

I was the one who took the objective point of view, but I didn't mean there is some sort of check list that makes music good or not. I was just trying to say that we as humans can think critically about things, so if we don't like a certain album that doesn't mean it's actually bad. We are capable of acknowledging that certain music just isn't for us, but it can still be good. You get what I'm saying? It's closed minded to call something bad just because you don't like it. If you can make valid points as to why it's bad then that's a different story.

 

May 15, 2016

Not when you have an objective classic like Finally Rich

 

May 15, 2016

Yup, sounds like a Lupe fan.

 

May 15, 2016

im sorry but like it's an incredibly easy concept to understand and like 7 different people explained it perfectly to you, I am legitimently blown away that you aren't understanding this.

 

May 15, 2016

i feel like op lowkey an actual r----- irl

 

May 15, 2016

This is a post from another forum but I feel like it's relevant to post here:

 

May 15, 2016

Because that's how I feel about those projects

 

May 15, 2016

could you be any more of a blowhard.

 

May 15, 2016

well my opinion is objective

 

May 15, 2016

holy s--- how do you still not get it

 

May 15, 2016

Why are the people that are saying music is obviously subjective also the ones that will say in other threads that one album is better than the other when better is an clearly objective term