Feb 11, 2015 Fantastic? Saul has ten fingers in Breaking Bad. Zero tension. Nobody cares about the two skater goofs to start with. I've seen Walt down a few hands in the desert before in scenarios that put it shame. From the beginning of the scene you know Saul will be let go and they'll form a relationship. But yeah, the haggling was a laugh. The shots I like are little flourishes here and there. The lantern lit interior, the mixed drink, from behind the coffee machine, the overhead turinal, etc. There's no cohesive voice to it that I find impressive. Maybe True Detective and movies have spoiled me on that front. I like that the show feels a little dated. A little more 90s than BB. That's neat.
Feb 11, 2015 Bro the whole point of the series is that we know where it ends up. That's actually kind of a complaint I have tbh -- but that's besides the point (like, how am I supposed to get invested knowing that Saul ends up a depressing and crying into his whiskey?) But as far as this show goes, it will 100% be more about the execution than the content. At least for this first season. So when I say that scene was fantastic, I'm not talking from a breaking bad "raising the stakes" type way. It was the whole package - the beautiful scenery (which I like how I it looks even though some want it to be "gritter" and less digital), the implication of Saul playing judge & jury, the haggling (lmaoo) and just the dialogue in general. And then on top of all that, the directing and the pace was top-notch BB quality. The scene never ends where you think it will, and actually going through the act of breaking the legs and saul's reaction/the SFX was, indeed, fantastic I think you're being for the sake of it right now. I'm sure you'll have a lot of legitimate criticisms to make but wait for some more episodes at least Yeah the show is definitely trying to embrace, and flip, the conventional style for lawyer-type shows such as this. One of my favorite scenes was when we saw Saul in action for the first time with the 19 year olds. The shot from under the TV/above the VCR to show the jury's reactions, the way the prosecutor didn't say a word and just rolled out that tv/all the people slowly moving over to the other side of the room to watch it >>> The thing is we're only TWO episodes in. And there would no where NEAR this amount of stuff to talk about for a more typical show. Better Call Saul feels pretty special already
Feb 11, 2015 Watched both episodes last night and I thought they were both very solid. I'm still kind of in disbelief that this show happened (and is good, no less). There's a lot of room to f--- this up still, but I have faith. As long as they keep building upon the surrounding mythos of Saul/other minor characters and don't directly tamper with Breaking Bad's timeline, I think it's gonna end up working out. Introducing Mike & Tuco in the first episode didn't feel forced at all to me, especially because the Tuco twist was great (it would make sense that's how he got into the biz) and it's unclear how exactly Mike will come into play yet.
Feb 11, 2015 @Narsh I like how I haven't see enough of the show to have problems with it, but your praise never hints at being premature. You wrote 2,000 words on a Kanye single. You know how easy it is to break something down at long lengths. So half of the reason you like that scene comes down to loving a recycled setting. Call it homage, but it's certainly not groundbreaking. I don't understand why you think there was any weight to the scene. It was shooting for a tension it hadn't earned. It was a punchline. A funny one, but FANTASTIC? That's awfully sensational. h---, have an interesting character of it's own besides Tuco and set it in a aircraft hanger and we're talking a different story altogether. We're learning about a new, probably important, person. We're not recalling a familiar setting from BB. We're building a unique atmosphere. But no, there are no balls. It's standing alone about as often as Talking Dead and not far off in purpose. Tell Vince Gilligan to stop winking at me so much. This show has done little more than make me laugh and feel nostalgia. I might seem contrarian, but only because I'm defending my opinion. The things I like about it aren't controversial lol.
Feb 11, 2015 The show is great so far in my opinion, I was not expecting Tuco to turn up at all, at least not that early. Mike looks old as f--- too, puttin' in that work tho 'Like a troll under a bridge.. YOU SHALL NOT PASS' The guy who played Vaas in Far Cry 3 has a good role in this too, looking forward to see how that evolves, my assumption is that he dies as he's not in BB but who knows, I also remember the trailer showing him and Saul in a police interview room, could be interesting. Get back at the thread next Tuesday.
Feb 11, 2015 feel sorry for people that cant enjoy something without nitpicking. must be some type of attention disorder.
Feb 11, 2015 Something needs to be groundbreaking to be fantastic? And how did you get recycled setting being the only thing I liked? I said I LOVED the pace of the scene -- they way you couldn't tell when it was gonna end or cut to commercial/the next scene. They way they panned away to the bodies after the first broken leg, and hearing the 2nd leg break off screen. Raymond Cruz as Tuco was great, and actually hilarious, and Bob Odenkirk was perfect. It's not sensational, it's an honest reaction to a scene that's objectively pretty f---ing high quality for ANY other show in existence. It's been 2 episodes. You're not even gonna give him 2 episodes of "fan service" after making one of the GOAT shows?
Feb 11, 2015 I said the recycled setting was half the reason. It was like a third of what you wrote. Honestly lol. I watched it without commercials so maybe that didn't affect me as much? Like I said, I felt no tension. I explained why in detail. As far as the on/off screen with the broken leg, @FilmAndWhisky did a Harvard keynote thing on the reality beyond the frame that's pretty neat. You can check it out here. I mean I don't see what's so special about gore presented the way they did it. Yeah, they're good characters. I agree. Breaking Bad made them that way. I'm going to call it how I see it. I'm not going to pretend to enjoy rushed fan service. If you want this to be it's own thing, which was in the presser IIRC, then do it. Or market it differently.
Feb 11, 2015 No I don't think you seem contrarian at all, your critiques are pretty spot-on. I agree with them. That's not to say I'm writing the show off or even that I'm disappointed (I thought it was a lot of fun, actually, and I'm optimistic that it will improve with time), but I felt the inclusion of Tuco so early on and so prominently felt like a crutch I was hoping the show wouldn't need. Gilligan and Co. seemed too intent on saying HEY GUYS REMEMBER BREAKING BAD rather than building something unique and original. Like I said, it's early, and I think this is off to a pretty d--- good start all things considered (it's significantly better than a spinoff of a secondary character like Saul has any right to be, really). It had a solid mix of comedy and drama, both executed well, that the show will need to master if it's going to work. But you're not wrong that it's a long way from establishing a compelling identity of its own.
Feb 11, 2015 You're obviously not wrong about any of what Swizz touched on @CharlieWork , and I never said you were either, but my point still remains that these are pretty heft criticism you're trying to place on a show that's 2 episodes in. And what's so rushed about this "fan service?" Seems pretty well done to me. We have absolutely NO idea where this is going yet. They've BARELY set up minor characters -- but they're still there. They're giving fans of the show this spun off from some fan service, and, you know what? When it's being done this well, complaining about it DOES seem contrarian to me. Like, if they are still doing this kind of stuff heavily by episode 5, I'll eat my words. h---, I'd probably even be agreeing with you/supporting your crusade. My praise isn't too soon because I'm not talking about the show as a whole, I'm talking about what we've seen -- quality that can actually already be judged. You seem to be making remarks about the show as a whole, as if these 2 episodes define what it is, or will become.
Feb 11, 2015 I thought the show started off incredible and had a feel to it that was great, unique and completely different than Breaking Bad(in a good way). That all went out the window the moment Tuco showed up and really carried over to the second episode. I thought the second episode was pretty meh tbh. The good news is it's still better than anything else on TV right now and it's early so there's plenty of time to turn it around. I mean it's good television but just not what I was expecting. To be fair though my expectations were insanely high and maybe they shouldn't have been.
Feb 11, 2015 Nah man, keep your expectations high. I think this show will definitely live up to them. As for liking the 1st more that eh 2nd -- that's pretty odd. Almost everyone I know thought the 2nd was much more entertaining. But I can see why the 1st would feel more unique, and therefore be more likable/appealing to you. I love the vibe this show has going on for it. Saul has a lot of the same characteristics as Walt when it comes to smooth talking, lying, manipulation, etc. So the basic BB formula would work here, but they're making it more cartoony and comedic, and I think the dynamics will only continue to change/evolve as we watch
Feb 11, 2015 Watched both episodes just now. Much better than I expected. Looking forward to the rest of the season
Feb 11, 2015 True story. I spent A night drinking with Bob Odinkirk, Dave Cross and John Ennis with John Ennis buying me and best friend's drinks and us buying Bob and David's drinks. Greatest night of my early 20's.
Feb 11, 2015 You contradicted yourself pretty quickly. I don't know how to respond to claims that I'm extrapolating too much. All I've talked about have been these two episodes with specific examples from them included. At length. You're okay with the show building on a lot of familiar things. I think it's lazy. I don't see this going anywhere.
Feb 12, 2015 What's so bad about BrBa references. I mean a lot of people loved them and expected them to be. I am pretty sure they will wear it off, but they did what fans expected. Talking about this show not being able to carry on without going back to BrBa, but d--- this is a spin off to one of the greatest tv shows ever made, how is it supposed to not make those references. I mean, it is a prequel, not a TV show based on a whole new original story(Actually is, but still a spin off). I love it, and I am 100% sure that it has to bring some nostalgia, at some point. Everything about the show is great, the directing, visuals, montage, dramatic perepities, the cast. It tried to bring dark comedy vibe to it, and it surely did it with a great execution, I haven't seen much movies with such strong directing work this year, and we are talking about a TV show. You can't judge it the same way you judge The True Detective. In terms of quality yes, but not in terms of having references to something. I mean, even with The True Detective they used same old tools of refurbished material.
