Oct 30, 2015

it isnt justified, but it requires context. that said, ive heard about the officer, his issues.... i don't doubt it. in my experience, schools like this do not attract the best and brightest professionals. its cyclical, is my point. i literally just said the officer's actions were beside the point.

why is this happening, why are we hiring cops at all goes to a deeper question in our education system. you can shame the assault itself, i applaud u... but i dont know what ur truly qualified to propose besides indignation

 

Oct 30, 2015

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackson_State_killings

 

Oct 30, 2015

Mayb we can rid ourselves of campus cops altogether because it's detrimental to the learning environment

 

Oct 30, 2015

sure, i agree. but evidently there's a need. why are cops being put there? in my experience, some of these kids are extrmeely disruptive/violent and the teachers rarely have the support of the county, let alone the parents.

lets have a real discussion, and stop this pointless internet outrage silliness. share info from your schools so we know exactly what everyones pov is: http://www.schooldigger.com/

 

Oct 30, 2015

two things:

1. people aren't denied the right to indignation over abuses like this until they have a position paper vetted.
2. of course there are tons of cyclical, systemic factors at play that led each party to that point. those are what need to be addressed to ultimately end s--- like this. but in the immediate, none of those systemic factors shift the blame from the cop to the student. not at all.

EDIT: andy seeing that his middle school had a bunch of free lunch students:

 

Oct 30, 2015

Cops don't do s--- in that regard. As far as preventing actual crime all you had to is walk into a restroom to see a d--- deal going down and there were 2 cases of people selling guns in school that were only found out because kids snitched. If a kid is flipping s--- get the campus security guard to escort him out not a f---ing armed officer

 

Oct 30, 2015

Also sorry but not about to dig up statistics on my school just to earn perceived "street cred" (corny term) take it or leave it

 

Oct 30, 2015

Your assumptions are wrong...at least from what I've read. The girl that got assaulted was a 16 year old girl who new to the school, its not a cause of her "hijacking a teacher time on a daily basis" or whatever. When I was 16 and moved to a new, much bigger, school where there were security guards, mandatory IDs, and s---...I once got fed up too and wouldnt listen when told asinine things like "you cant wear your headphones in the hallway" and refused at time. It's f---ing high school, the adults there should be there to help the kids work through their issues, whatever they may be.

i find it unsettling you just assume the victim fits into whatever narrative you're trying to paint here rather than just assume this was an isolated incident. The cop school resource officer is the one with the clearly troubled history, not the student.

as one of the articles i read said it was just "age appropriate classroom behavior." Students get detention or suspension for disrupting a class. Not manhandled.

dont tell me I can't vouch for 16 year olds not being physically abused in a classroom b/c I may not have ever been "victim" of them disrupting class time. Not only have I been in those situations -- it just doesn't matter.

The way adults conduct themselves is much more important, and can have more of a tangible effect, than trying to force accountability on a 16 year old for being stubborn when told not to have her cell phone out

 

Oct 30, 2015

if they got in a shouting match and he grabbed her arm too tightly or whatever, sure. not when he's beating her senseless in her classroom. it's disproportionate to the point where everything kind of goes out the window.

so @captain awesome i get what you're saying in a broad sense, and you know that we agree. but the usual routes of analysis fail in exceptional cases like this, no?

 

Oct 30, 2015

be indignant about the right things - thats my point. rhetorically, i just think it's a little too easy. you know the internet is prone to outrage. like ofc the cop is the person ultimately responsible... but incidents like this deserve a deeper conversation then what the majority of people online seem capable.

just saying, having attended a s--- horrible school before, i understand the frustration. it doesnt excuse anything, but i explicitly remember thinking (while having our class disrupted for the umpteenth time): god what the f--- is wrong with these kids? (id also question why the teachers were so bad)

 

Oct 30, 2015

U were THAT kid smh Andy

 

Oct 30, 2015

He wasnt a cop in that scenario, he was a school resource officer asked to de-escalate a disruptive situation with a 16 year old girl (which was probably only disruptive because the teacher kept interrupting his own class to ask to put away a cellphone...not like she was doing the Drake Hotline Bling dance around the room)

How the f--- is the cop NOT a monster for doing that to a 16 year old girl? You're ridiculous.

 

Oct 30, 2015

as i was saying to you the other day, i think this is an example of a time where you're flexing your political stances in situations that aren't perfect fits for your arguments. yes, issues of students, teachers, and outside authority in some schools are infinitely complex. no, those factors do not make this instance in particular any more than meets the eye.

(there's also a larger discussion about a false binary of sorts: the internet and culture writ large run on outrage right now, often detrimentally. but that doesn't mean there aren't things worth being outraged over, and it doesn't mean that outrage is never justified, or useful.)

 

Oct 30, 2015

>we need cops bcuz kids get disruptive
>cop grabs girl, throws her around and causes desk to fly and make a s--- ton of noise
>every kid is either distracted recording or keeping their head down out of sheer terror

 

Oct 30, 2015

that could be, ive heard mixed accounts. im making a broader point about these kinds of poor schools and why things like this are borne from frustration. thats why i asked people share details about what kinds of hs they went to (sry @Skippy but i think its 100% relevant; context is king in debates)

you can be "unsettled" @Narsh but i rly think you need to have attended one of these schools to appreciate what its like to teach, etc.

call me cpt awesome, 1. and 2. um... did you read the stats i posted? it was savage lol and i wanted out. sry not sry

 

Oct 30, 2015

 

Oct 30, 2015

Look at you...again making excuses for this poor defenseless girl...

"she was probably only disruptive because the teacher did this and this and this"...ummmmm, yeah that's probably why...she couldn't have possible done anything wrong because she's the victim...I'm agreeing that CLEARLY the cop overreacted, but she put herself in a situation that could have easily been avoided, and you can't process that...

 

Oct 30, 2015

 

Oct 30, 2015

I've moved like 6 times throughout my primary education, ive attended a variety of different schools

Unless a student is being violent, no adult on the campus has a right to get physical with them. In my opinion. But I know security guards etc exist to de-escalate situations like this, and I'm with that @ schools where its necessary. But JUST that...security guards for deescalation

not barbaric sadists with a histroy of harassment

but i get your overall point...i just think its unnecessary to use this scenario to shrug off the grossly disproportional actions of the school resource officer and talk about how some kids really are disruptive and need to be dealt with blah blah blah.

 

Oct 30, 2015

exactly. andy has a point, i just don't think it applies when the cop jumps the shark to this degree.