Jun 21, 2016 it doesnt discount the other stuff I said about sharia law, that is not the Islamic extremism that you're talking about. Sharia is actually quite common in most middle eastern countries with a few anomalies like Turkey. These are the views of the Muslims that you guys are adamantly defending.
Jun 22, 2016 Yes you can. Actually, the Muslim countries have a way lower crime rate than atheist or Christian countries. also, you think Islam is about cutting people hands off and killing gays, it's not. Yes, Islam had a political vocation in the 6th century because Muhammad used it to govern Medine, and it does include the rules people had to follow at the 6th century, and they're completely immoral and disgusting compared to now. But that's not due to Islam or religion, it's due to the time the Qur'an was written. But if you read or analyze the Qur'an you will discover the five pillars of Islam are faith, charity, prayer, fasting and pilgrimage to Mecca. That's what being Muslim is really about, not about not eating pork and cutting the hands of thiefs.
Jun 22, 2016 I have a question for those who are more likely to vote for Brexit. What has convinced you to think that leaving EU will be better for the UK? 1/ The immigration that may bring danger to your citizens in the form of terrorist attacks 2/ Too big number of immigrants who allegedly steal your jobs and harm the economy 3/ Too big involvement of the EU in your domestic policies; too much bureaucracy; EU politics slowing down UK's economic growth etc. 4/ The pride of being 'independent' and the slogans such as "Make Great Britain great again"
Jun 22, 2016 I love immigration but the numbers are too high- terrorism itself is honestly not the issue at all here, I don't really know why this thread descended into this. The EU is also definitely too involved in domestic policies, it was originally meant to be an economic union but somehow has now turned into a political union whose goal is an United States of Europe. The intervening in domestic policies may be easier to stomach for some if it was at least remotely democratic but this is, of course, not the case.
Jun 22, 2016 Ok, now tell me in what domestic policies EU is involved and why do you think its involvement it's too big. Secondly, it's not true that European Communities were meant to be solely an economic union. It was supposed to descend into political, fiscal and cultural union within the next decades. Here's the proof https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Political_Community Thirdly, the current structure of the EU is very, very far from United States Of Europe. There's no good definition to describe this tbh. It's unique in its own way. It has some characteristics of federation and international organization, but you can't define it in one word. Also, where do your concerns come from? There are no such plans at all. If anything, there are plans to tighten up integration between the countries in regard to the member states who pay in euros. From what I remember UK has a special treatment in this aspect, so what's the problem? Lastly, that mythical immigration problem...The articles and statistics I've seen aren't really showing big increase in the last couple of years. It's very much the same as it was a few years ago. Furthermore, you do realize that after Brexit you will still have to be a part of the free trade area just like Norway and Switzerland and nothing really would change? You do realize that Norway, despite being out of EU, still has immigrants coming to their country just like the citizens of the member states? If you were born in EU and have an ID you can visit them whenever you want. I swear to God if you vote for brexit I'd go to the UK and steal you a job to prove you were f---ing wrong the whole time. Spoiler I'm joking of course
Jun 22, 2016 The EEC in the way it was branded to the UK in the 1973 referendum was as an economic union only. 60% of UK laws in the last few years have been from the EU, only around 5% of the businesses in the UK actually trade with the EU yet all of them have to abide by the regulations that are tailored for big business and thus put needless strain on small and medium sized businesses. This is impacting the economy with regulations calculated at costing the UK £600 million a week. Also, the EU is dictating to us in areas where it should not even be concerned such as divorce law. As for the United States of Europe- that is the ultimate goal of the union with 'ever closer union' being written in the treaties. Before the United States of America, there was the Confederate States of America, the EU currently already has more power than that union. All it will really take to make a United States of Europe is a European army which is actually on the table: As for the special status of the UK, it isn't really enshrined in law and is not really worth anything, the reform that David Cameron conducted did not amount to anything and the fact that the Eurozone countries are integrating more would just make the UK position more awkward in the EU. As for immigration, the numbers are increasing and are likely to increase further with the Euro disaster that is happening and potential expansion of the EU. Even without an increase, the numbers as they currently are are just unsustainable. The whole open borders idea may have been plausible when countries with similar GDP per capita were only considered, it isn't plausible now and is putting a lot of stress on wages and public services. The UK currently has a housing crisis because of it. After Brexit, we wouldn't have to be part of the same institution as Norway, we don't need to be in the single market, all we need is a free trade agreement which is mutually beneficial and that's it. The EU really is an outdated institution as it is and seems to be incapable of reform.
Jun 22, 2016 http://infacts.org/mythbusts/regulations-cost-british-business-600-million-per-week/ Are you seriously comparing Confederate States of America to the EU? There are 28 countries in the EU and everyone should know, even the EU authorities that it will be impossible to have all these nations formed into one country. There are too many differences. Moreover, the creation of the European Army will not be the last step of that process even if it takes place in the future. If it comes to all the money you save every year thanks to the special status, how can you say it's not worth anything? Isn't money the biggest issue of being the member of the EU? It doesn't make sense to me at all. The EU has been making concessions in the last two years to convince you to stay, but you and other millions of people who back brexit are just saying that 'EU is incapable of reform'. It's a huge hypocrisy dude. As for the UK being only a member of FTA... Are you guys really believe that? The EU will not agree to these terms. There is a reason why Norway belongs to the single market.
Jun 22, 2016 h--- no this s--- will be the end for the eu and s--- about to go down in europe and the world because of some nationalist thing their country is more important than the global situation you dont leave an economic and political union Man in the early 2000 the world felt more open to unity than now I know the eu is in crisis but that has also something to do with capitalism who should have been reformed after the big crisis in 2008 that we still drag on to this day and there is no serious change in the system I know being mad against eu is right and the democratic aspect is questionable also they economic regulations are also not healthy but don't throw away years of unity and better economical and political situation because you feel bad you need to do revolution in another way but some people see in this referendum might be the "revolution" they need . I am from Germany and some racist use anti eu statements to promote also their nationalism The internet should show you that we f---ing are not different people but that we already have this image of one world because in the internet no one can proclaim their sovereignty
Jun 22, 2016 we're going to have to agree to disagree when it comes to Islam because we're going in circles. I think if you embrace all aspects, which includes Sharia Law, then it is inherently violent. not to mention there are at least 100 verses in the Quran that call for violence against non believers. If you arent going to accept that, then we have really nothing left to talk about. By the way, of course it matters how the Quran was written. It directly has to do with Islam. It all matters. You can't cherrypick which parts of the faith you want to deem relevant or important, if you embrace absolutely all parts of it, then its not the "religion of peace"
Jun 22, 2016 The EU is not like any other union in the world. It is much closer to a United States of Europe than you are letting on. The ultimate goal of the EU is ever closer union, that is a fact that is written in the treaties and supported by the leaders of the EU. 60% of UK laws are made by the EU, the EU has its own currency, a central bank, a parliament, 5 presidents, all it needs is an army then it is effectively a United States of Europe. The special status is bogus, we don't have a special status, it costs us to stay in the EU and anchor ourselves to a dying union. This is a globalised world, why would we want to anchor ourselves to the only part of it that is not showing the ability to lead the future. The EU has not made concessions at all to make us stay, it is pretty much universally agreed in the UK that the deal that Cameron got is effectively nothing. If the EU wanted to reform, it could but it doesn't have the appetite for reform and instead is sinking into more integration. The UK is not Norway, the EU will have to agree with the terms as its beneficial to them as well. Why wouldn't the EU want a free trade agreement with a country that it currently has a trade deficit with? The biggest lobby in Brussels is the German car industry and they will of course want to continue tariff free trading. Many countries around the world have free trade agreements with the EU without being actually in the single market. At the end of the day this question is about democracy. The EU is not just undemocratic but its anti-democratic with the way its operating. Its almost as if you have to lose an election to get a place in the EU.
Jun 22, 2016 You couldn't more simplify the concept of the united states of Europe. http://greenash.net.au/thoughts/2012/08/how-close-is-the-european-union-to-being-a-federation/ I didn't say that the UE wouldn't want to have a free trade area agreement with you, but that they will do anything to make you a part of the single market.
Jun 22, 2016 Apart from the UK and Denmark, every country in the EU is actually required to join the Euro at some point so that article is actually wrong by stating that the EU isn't close to a USE due to not having a single currency. As for the other points, such as the federal constitution, as it states the Lisbon treaty is effectively doing this part. Of course, as of now a USE does not exist but to deny that it is close and heading to that direction is simply wrong man: https://ec.europa.eu/priorities/pub...leting-europes-economic-and-monetary-union_en As for the free trade agreement, what can they actually do to force us into the single market? If we don't join then we don't join.
Jun 22, 2016 What I don't get is how people don't realize that Sharia Law is not "radical Islam" it is the norm for countries in the middle east, with the exception of Turkey and some parts of Indonesia These are the Muslims that the left is defending so vigorously. people that do not agree with your way of life. Incompatible.
Jun 22, 2016 How Europe will break on Brexit http://www.politico.eu/article/how-europe-will-break-on-brexit-brexit-map/ Ireland — Top concern: Economic impact France — Top concern: Rise of Euroskepticism Belgium — Top concern: Economic impact Luxembourg — Top concern: Blow to EU morale Netherlands — Top concern: Rise of Euroskepticism Germany — Top concern: Blow to EU morale Czech Republic — Top concern: Economic impact Poland — Top concern: Citizens in U.K. Hungary — Top concern: Loss of an ally Slovakia — Top concern: Citizens in U.K. Austria — Top concern: Rise of Euroskepticism Lithuania — Top concern: Citizens in U.K. Finland — Top concern: Rise of Euroskepticism Sweden — Top concern: Loss of an ally Denmark — Top concern: Rise of Euroskepticism Italy — Top concern: Rise of Euroskepticism Malta — Top concern: Economic impact Greece — Top concern: Economic impact Spain — Top concern: Economic impact
Jun 22, 2016 how? Sharia law is violent, dont try to claim otherwise. Lots of middle eastern countries use sharia law. dont continue this bs argument
